"Morning Routine"

Gale having a one-sided conversation with Tara about how he can't/won't confess his feelings to Tav.

Clearing up the vampire bride theory

There's a lot of misinformation surrounding this vampire bride fan theory. As someone who has the book the theory allegedly comes from, I want to provide important context that's always left out in posts about it.

Note: It's fine if you like this headcanon and want to use it for your own RP. But posts about this headcanon tend to present it as a factual and canon concept. I want people to have all the information so that they're fully informed when they decide to believe in it or not. There's a lot of evidence that it isn't canon. Everyone is welcome to see their character how they like. No one is saying you can't have fun. The problem is misinformation.

First, the 2e book this theory stems from (Van Richten's Guide to Vampires) is from 1991. That's over 3 decades and three editions of DnD ago. None of this lore has been mentioned in the current edition of DnD, 5e, as far as I've seen. DnD staff have officially said that each edition of DnD is its own canon. They don't want fans to need archaic sourcebooks to understand the current lore.

"The current edition of the D&D roleplaying game has its own canon, as does every other expression of D&D… Every edition of the roleplaying game has its own canon as well. In other words, something that might have been treated as canonical in one edition is not necessarily canonical in another…we don’t want DMs or players to feel like they must read a novel, play a video game, or buy a third-edition sourcebook to enjoy our game and get the most out of our current line of products."

Now, I'm not saying that every edition of DnD is completely different and doesn't draw from older versions. But it's clear that DnD staff don't want old sourcebooks to be needed to understand current products. That's why it's significant that vampire bride lore has not shown up again in a decade of 5e. There is an updated 2021 version of the Van Richten book: Van Richten's Guide to Ravenloft. This 5e version still has no mention of vampire bride lore.

Ravenloft is also a different campaign setting from the Forgotten Realms, which is where BG3 takes place. Their lore is not necessarily interchangeable.

While BG3 doesn't follow DnD 5e lore 100%: One can't use a 2e sourcebook to argue that the vampire bride theory is true, and also say sourcebooks aren't important because BG3 is its own property.

Even if we accept what is in the 1991 Van Richten's Guide to Vampires: The ritual states that the sire vampire's age must be AT LEAST twice Astarion's vampire age.

"Creating a bride or groom, although seemingly a simple process, requires an exhausting exercise of much power by the creating vampire. For this reason, only vampires of advanced age and capability can even assay this procedure. A bride or groom can be created only by a vampire of age category Ancient or greater, and not even all of those are capable of doing so." (pg 71)

The Ancient vampire age category starts at 400 years (pg 13). Astarion has been a vampire spawn for 200 years and an ascended vampire for barely any time at all.

If one argues Astarion can do this ritual anyway because he's a special ascended vampire… Well, the book's ritual is about normal vampires. If AA is this unique, it can be easily argued that he can't do the ritual and make a vampire bride, because he's not a normal vampire. This logic can be applied both ways. The idea behind becoming an ascended vampire is that things which affect a normal vampire won't affect him anymore. Not to mention, Astarion himself says it will take more time for him to come into his full power. So how can he be as powerful as an ancient vampire already? Alternatively, if he is this powerful and special, who says he can't compel and control a Vampire Bride anyway?

The book also describes the sire losing lots of blood to the bride, to the point that the sire is weakened. Astarion gives us "just one drop" and shows no sign of being weakened after turning us. Nor do we see evidence of a feeding frenzy.

"The vampire opens a gash in its own flesh—often in its throat—and holds the subject’s mouth to the wound. As the burning draught that is the vampire’s blood gushes into the subject’s mouth, the primitive feeding instinct is triggered, and she sucks hungrily at the wound, enraptured. With the first taste of the blood, the subject is possessed of great and frenzied strength, and will use it to prevent the vampire from separating her from the fountain of wonder that is its bleeding wound. It is at this point that the creator-vampire’s strength is most sorely tested. He is weakened by his own blood loss." (pg 72)

The vampire bride ritual requires the sire to make 3 bites. People disagree over how many times Astarion bites Tav or Durge in the turning scene. And he bites once before the turning if you agree to the romance scene. This is a separate optional bite which tends to get treated as a guaranteed ritual bite.

There's also no evidence of any telepathic bond post-tadpole in the game during the epilogue.

"One of the reasons “married vampires” are so difficult to defeat is that a vampire and its bride share a telepathic communication that has a range measured in miles. Regardless of intervening terrain or obstacles, the two vampires can communicate instantly and silently as if they were speaking together." (pg 74)

Even if we accept the outdated 2e lore of vampire brides, there's numerous ways that the ritual in the sourcebook doesn't match what happens when AA turns Tav or Durge. Depending on how you count the bites, one can argue that nothing from the ritual matches what's in the game!

Great addition by @/nicsnort: "Let us also not forget that the very nature of necromancy and undeath changed between 2e and 5e due to the Spellplague and the destruction of the Negative Energy Plane. So, not only is the canon of the Bride ritual outdated, but this ritual very well may not work anymore for even 400+-year-old vampires because magic itself is different!"

This is without even talking about how something so major which goes against everything we're told about master-spawn relationships in the game... would have been clearly discussed in the actual game.

On the topic of what's in the actual game: Just because the player character can walk in the sun doesn't mean they aren't a vampire spawn. Cazador gives some of his spawn the ability to teleport, and the companions express surprise that it's possible. Yet no one denies they are still vampire spawn.

I hope this post gives you extra context on the vampire bride theory. Overall, it's clear that this is old lore which is not canon to the current edition of DnD. Whether you think Larian decided to apply it to BG3 or not, at least now that belief will be fully informed.

If this post was useful or interesting to you, please reblog so more people can see it! I've made a updates to it a few times to address replies I've had, so check my original post for the latest version.

Happy Easter 💕

Predaetor Astarion 🐺🩸

Tomorrow Catch 22 Sylus x Astarion. Uhm, yes… I love my silver-haired, crimson-eyed men.

elf pile..

umm i need reassurance that my presence is wanted but i can’t ask for reassurance because that’s really Embarrassing and it wouldn’t feel genuine if i asked for it

20 hours of painting condensed into a minute. I'll never get enough of his stupid face.

I want to bite this person who started a completely dummy rumor about Ascended Astarion has no soul:

According to Astarion himself, the price 7000 souls was paid.

During the ritual, when the souls are taken away, the bodies explode.

There is no information about vampire souls in the DnD rules. People are constantly arguing on this topic, but it all depends on DM. If true vampires don't have souls, then spawn don't have souls either. Their condition differs only in the level of power.

If you reading Cazador's thoughts, you will know that he is suffering.

Astarion is an ascended vampire and most likely feels better than a true vampire. This is what the narrator means when talking about the pleasures alive. That's the reason Cazador wanted the ritual.

There is also no information in the game that Astarion has lost his soul. The key phrase is "he has changed", which can mean anything. A good example it's Ulma's word "power corrupts". Maybe he just became arrogant because of the new power? Think about it.

If you play Origin Astarion, you will also not see any words about someone took his soul. He will feel happy and alive, and not "empty" or "changed".

There are also no notes from the developers about lost soul or "soullessness" in the script.

Even his changes can be justified, look at what Astarion says before he gets to the city:

Even pre-ritual, he is very determined, and he does it not just to walk under the sun, but to gain POWER.

Now you know what to answer when they tell you Ascended Astarion is "soulless" ^-^ Of course, it can be their personal headcanon, if they want it that way. But then they shouldn't impose it on you!

I see the Tavs coming to pick them up and see the babies playing peacefully with each other while the Astarions, daggers drawn, try to explain why their baby is the best in the multiverse.

All the Tav/Astarion babies from the picrew are warming my heart. I love this fandom so much.

Corset.

[Many thanks to @ria-neearts for lighting and fixing the whole mess this artwork was ♥]