Hi I'm Mona, I'm 35 years old and live in Switzerland, I have a small Twitch stream under Vio_Wolf where I show a lot of DND and also play other games. Baldurs Gate is my absolute favourite at the moment. I hope you forgive my bad English as it is not my native language. You'll see, I love Astarion more than anything, I don't care if Spawn or Ascended, I liked the guy even before I knew his backstory and even more afterwards. .
147 posts
Gale having a one-sided conversation with Tara about how he can't/won't confess his feelings to Tav.
a little bit about a-i
(more than the A-l itself in art I am tired of people who run around and infringe on living artists, so this is a small scrappy sketch on this topic)
The dragonrider đĄď¸
Here is the dragon in full size (well, almost full size đĽ˛). Itâs a white vampiric dragon, Astarionâs spawn (neither Durge, nor a dragonborn)
thirsty hoe
modernbat: a claw machine
I was mentioned in a pro-Ascendant Astarion post with this quote: "Astarion does not have a well-developed sense of self, and by default, he also lacks many of the skills that a well-adjusted adult should possess." This is the post itâs taken from: click me!
No problem at allâit's public, and I donât see why anyone shouldnât reference it. Naturally, the post was in opposition to that statementâgenerally speaking, I meanâbut thatâs fine too. Everyone has their own opinion and is free to express it. Thatâs not the point of my upcoming ramble! xD
Itâs just that rereading my own words got me thinking more deeply about the topic and made me want to explore it further.
Now, Iâm not a psychologist, but I did study psychology. I took several exams at university and I actually did pretty well, lol. I didnât complete my studies because life took me elsewhereâmost importantly, my daughter was bornâbut the general knowledge I gained from psychology still follows me in everything I do every day.
So itâs second nature for me to analyze characters from the media I consume through that lensâAstarion included. Of course, this is just my perspective; I canât say for certain whether the developers intended this for his character or whether they did specific research into his psychological development.
That said, today I feel like going off on a little tangent about this beautiful science. Still in reference to that heart-stealing vampire spawn that Iâm aaaaabsolutely not obsessed with.
Let me also add a disclaimer. The concepts mentioned are just examples and cannot be applied literally, as every person is different and reacts differently to situations and stimuli. Likewise, the brain is plasticâneural connections change and adapt, and there is almost never a fixed or definitive condition. Above all, Iâm not making any kind of diagnosis! Thatâs not within my competence! Keep these ideas well in mind!
So, why do I say that Astarion doesnât have a well-developed sense of self? Letâs take it step by step and talk a little about the concept of the "self". I'm copy-pasting something from another post, lol. Rewriting it from scratch is too much work! xP
The self is quite a complex concept with many facets. Briefly put, itâs shaped by various internal and external factors and reflects a conscious image of "me." In psychology, itâs key to building the Ego of an individualâthe capacity to act, understand, organize, and interpret experiences. The Ego provides a sense of uniqueness, coherence, and personal continuity since the self encompasses many "faces." All this forms the personality of an individual, which naturally develops (and changes) throughout life.
Particular attention in the formation of the self is given to sensitive periods, such as early childhood. The self determines the level of self-esteem based on an individualâs assessment of their worth and competence in the characteristics they attribute to themselves (Real Self), their future aspirations (Ideal Self), and what they want to avoid (Feared Selves). The greater the discrepancy between these aspects, the lower the level of self-esteem. Social support and approval, as well as competence in domains deemed important to the self, obviously contribute to perceiving oneself as a person of value.
Astarion, as we know, has had his sense of self fundamentally undermined. For him, the world is divided between those who have power and those who donât, with the former always being the "winners" in his eyes. The magistrate he once was is long dead, along with his moral compass and the life he used to liveâespecially after 200 years of servitude to Cazador.
As vampire spawn, akin to a newborn in some respects, Astarion learned to exist solely within Cazadorâs world, revolving around Cazador, for Cazador.
There are lines of dialogue within the game that highlight this in a painful and terrifying way. For example, when Tav/Durge directly confronts Cazador, or when Cazador ends up on his knees in front of Astarion after one of his brothers or sisters dies during the ritual. Cazador says: âHe [Astarion] is afraid. Heâs afraid because all he has ever knows is you and me. And without us, he is nothing.â Or: âAnd then? What will you be without me? A shade? A specrte in the shadows, devoid of all purpose.â
Itâs a terrible thing, but itâs true. Cazador represents everythingâAstarionâs entire worldâand when he dies, he leaves behind a void thatâs even more frightening. And letâs not forget that, in the real world, it takes very little to completely erase a personâand two hundred years in the hands of an abuser is an overwhelming amount of time, a detail that too often gets underestimated or completely forgotten.
The whole matter becomes even more disturbing and painful when Cazador suggests that without Tav/Durge, Astarion would have come crawling back to him with his tail between his legs. To his fucking tormentor. And sadly, it's a painful concept because it really happens in real lifeâwhen you have nothing and no one, when you have no means of your own and are completely dependent on another person, no matter how terrifying they are. Cazador is certain that Astarion will return to him, even if it means dying. And it's a concept with a devastating impact.
So Cazador was the domineering father figure, and vampire society functions under strict rules handed down by vampire lords. In this hostile context, without any room for self-expression or choice, Astarion developed a fragmented and damaged self-image. Constantly belittled by Cazador as an individual (small, weak, useless, incapable, all words he uses in the game), always pitted against his brothers and sisters, and degraded from a magistrate to a prostitute (this is important because itâs the only skillâor "talent," as he calls it himselfâthat Astarion believes gives him any value or power, forming the basis for his self-image). Itâs easy to imagine just how high his self-esteem must be, right? Most importantly, he never developed the skills to navigate life as a free individualâat least not in a healthy way.
Good Lord, he thinks that in order to receive support, he has to sell himself to Tav/Durge and offer his sexual servicesâotherwise, he has no hope of survival! And thatâs why I say he doesnât possess all the skills of a well-adjusted adult. Other glaring examples of thisâso glaring they hit you like a punch in the eyeâare his inability to say no and to recognize his own limits. And shall we talk about the infamous question: What do you want? The first time, he deflects, and essentially gives the answer the player wants to hear. The second time, he states it plainly: he doesn't know. He doesn't know how to make decisions, he hasnât done it in 200 years, and the very idea terrifies him to his core. These are all skills that a well-balanced person possessesâletâs not kid ourselves.
Like any mature and well-balanced adult, one knows how to recognize their feelings, define them, communicate them, and most importantly, not fear them. Astarion, on the other hand, is unableâafter 200 years of pure shitâto understand what he feels for Tav/Durge, and he wonât be able to until the end of the Pale Elfâs quest. âI donât knowâbut isnât it nice, not to know? Youâre not a target, nor a victim, not just one night it's better to forget. But then... whatever in the world could you be?â
So, even if reluctantly (and despite his fear), he ends up leaning on Tav/Durge. He needs a guiding figure to help him figure out what to do because making decisions and acting independently donât come naturally to him. Especially outside of his talents, sex and survival. He needs to be rehabilitated, re-educated, and to achieve this, he requires a safe and healthy environment where he can experiment and grow, perhaps developing other faces of the self on which to base a new evaluation. Like, I'm not just a slave or a whore: but I'm also a companion, a friend, a lover, a hero and I'm able to listen, to help, to learn, to collaborate, etc.
And letâs not forget that when the fateful confrontation with Cazador is brought up, Astarion explicitly asks Tav/Durge for help. âI need to take the fight to him. And I need you to help me,â he says. How to help himâwhether to ascend or notâis up to the player and how they choose to play. But the fact remains: Astarion needs support.
Meanwhile letâs take a look at some of the consequences of low self-esteem:
Difficulty opening up in social settings and communicating one's emotions and needs
Extreme self-criticism
Devaluing or ignoring oneâs own qualities
Tendency to constantly apologize and feel guilty for things that are not actually one's responsibility
Tendency to appease others due to perceiving oneself as inferior to oneâs peers
Use of negative words to describe oneself
Difficulty making decisions and maintaining personal goals over time
Negative and self-blaming internal dialogue
Belief that success is due to luck, with difficulty attributing accomplishments to oneself
Not believing compliments that are given to them
And now, letâs look at the most common causes for the development of low self-esteem:
Being raised by extremely critical and demanding parents
Being heavily devalued by parents or other authority figures
Being ignored or ridiculed during childhood
Being a victim of physical, sexual, or psychological abuse
Achieving poor academic results
Experiencing episodes of bullying or mistreatment in the workplace
Suffering a financial collapse or a significant breakup
Being subjected to a prolonged period of stress
Suffering from a chronic and persistent medical condition
Suffering from psychological disorders (e.g., anxiety or depression)
Does this remind you of something? Or maybe someone in particular? Does that person, by any chance, have red eyes and pointed teeth?
Naturally, these are just examples, and everything varies depending on the individual, but I believe these points still manage to convey the concept.
They especially give the idea of how much eventsâand especially the context in which we liveâimpact our psyche. For example, thanks to neuroscience and increasingly detailed brain imaging, we know that brain areas change according to the factors mentioned above; they train like muscles, so to speak, becoming larger and more reactive every time they are activated.
So, if someone is subjected to chronic stress, the brain areas responsible for managing it will become easily activated, bringing with them a whole series of consequences that affect performance, behavior, perception, thinking, and so on.
Likewise, the more the ârightâ areas of the brain are activated, the more the brain itself will develop in a healthy and balanced way, forming neural connections that support the tools (perception, thinking, etc) mentioned above.
Meanwhile, other areasâsuch as those related to stress responsesâwill remain small and more difficult to activate. (Obviously, brain areas donât literally âgrowâ or âshrinkâ in size, but the connections between neurons (synapses) are strengthened or weakened depending on how much theyâre used. This is a principle known as âneural plasticityâ: what you use becomes reinforced, what you neglect becomes weaker.)
A curiosity: even our mood influences how we perceive people and the world around usâand consequently, our thoughts and impressions too! xD
This image is heartbreaking, because these brains belong to two three-year-old childrenâand the differences are significant.
The brain on the right is missing key areas that are present in the one on the left. These missing parts impact the abilities of the child with the smaller brain:
this child will likely be less intelligent as an adult compared to the one with the larger brain,
will be less capable of empathizing with others,
and will be at higher risk of becoming addicted to drugs and involved in violent crimes.
Additionally, the child with the smaller brain is more likely to remain unemployed and dependent on social services, and may develop mental health issues or other serious health problems.
The large difference in size and development between these two brains is not due to illness or injury, but rather to how the two children were treated by their mothers.
The child with the larger, more developed brain was loved by their mother, who was consistently present and attentive to their needs. The child with the smaller brain, on the other hand, was neglected and abused. It is precisely this difference in treatment that explains why one child's brain developed fully while the otherâs did not.
Of course, our favorite vampire spawn isnât a developing childâbut the point is that certain environments and experiences have a profound impact and shape many aspects of our lives, making us more or less equipped to face challenges.
At this point, Iâd like to focus a bit on the reasoning process in general. Itâs easy to believe that when humans think, make decisions, and reflect on a problem or task, they do so in the most rational way possible. And thatâs where we go wrong! First of all, the cerebral cortex â the part of the brain responsible for complex cognitive functions such as thinking, awareness, memory, attention, and language â is located in the upper region of the brain. Most stimuli, in order to reach the cortex, must pass through all the lower areas of the brain, which often trigger behavioral responses even before the stimulus reaches rational thought. For example, the activation of the sympathetic nervous system, which is responsible for danger responses. A silly example: how many times have we jumped out of our skin before realizing that the loud, scary noise was just a window slamming shut? First comes the fear response, then the evaluation of the stimulus follows.
As if that werenât enough, the brain plays other little tricks on us â without us even being aware of it â because that sneaky thing does a whole lot on its own, especially when it comes to thinking and making decisions.
So... Astarion has a very limited perspectiveâmostly the one offered by Cazador. As we said earlier, the world is divided into those who have power and those who suffer it. Period. But we all know that in between there are infinite shades of gray, and that canât be denied. In the same way, Astarion believes that Tav/Durge is the exception to the ruleâthe only kind person in the world, the one and only for him. But as much as it flatters our ego to hear that, we know very well that no one is that special. Itâs always Astarionâs perspective thatâs extremely limited. And in fact, here too, Tav/Durge has the opportunity to broaden his view, to point out that the world is full of kind people who would care for him if only he opened himself up and showed kindness in return. This narrow way of thinking and seeing things, this resistance to noticing alternatives, fits perfectly into the category of cognitive biases.
Letâs start with the premise that the human brain needs to be both effective and efficient. That means reaching a result in the shortest time and using the fewest resources. Therefore: when we think and make decisions, we donât always do so rationally. We use heuristicsâmental shortcutsâoften following patterns we've used before. A silly example: if I have to cook a dish Iâve made a hundred times, I donât sit down to rethink how and why I should cook itâI just switch off my brain and do it the way Iâve always done. Many heuristics are good and usefulâothers, not so much. And when they fall into the latter category, they become biases.
There are many types, but letâs look at one that we all, even us Astarion fans, share. xD Confirmation Bias!
Confirmation bias manifests when we tend to search for, interpret, or remember information that supports our pre-existing beliefs, ignoring anything that contradicts them or isnât completely aligned.
Once a certain mental imprint forms, new experiences only deepen that groove, without any willingness to explore other interpretative modesâin fact, they tend to further crystallize internal beliefs.
We can say that the person is cherry-pickingâin a complex set of data and information, they pick out only what resonates with a belief they already hold, which, in some way, is convenient for them.
The reason is easy to see: if I donât challenge a beliefâeven if itâs irrationalâIâll save time, create less friction, and reduce internal and external resistance to a given situation.
Because confirmation bias shows up when a person selects only the evidence that supports their point of view, it easily becomes a self-sustaining system, keeping them locked in an interpretive and experiential microcosm that risks becoming increasingly stiflingâa self-built prison.
Astarion is stuck on tracks heâs known inside and out for centuries, forcibly carved into his mindâand for him, itâs all too easy to filter everything through that lens. And this cuts him off from a myriad of possibilities, in a completely unconscious way. Itâs like throwing a wrench in your own gears. So Tav/Durge represents an opening to a different value system, one that could replace or at least expand our vampire spawnâs worldview. Not without resistance, of courseâthose brain connections will get you!
So, to conclude, letâs go back to the beginning and to the statement in question.
"Astarion does not have a well-developed sense of self, and by default, he also lacks many of the skills that a well-adjusted adult should possess."
Yes, maybe out of context it might sound bad. I certainly donât see Astarion as half a man, incapable of thinking or choosing for himself. But I do recognize that he has serious vulnerabilities that need to be treated with care and taken into account. Not when we're playingâwhen we play, we do what we like and have funâbut when we analyze him as a character. When Astarion, at the end of the Pale Elf quest, in the good ending, thanks us for saving him from himself, what he means, in my opinion, is exactly this: thank you for supporting me when my vulnerabilities, my fears, my blind spots, and my narrow perspective were getting the best of me. Because, letâs be honest, Astarionâs story is also about thisâabout rediscovery, about learning to live again, about changing, improving, growing, developing relationships, new abilities and skills. Not as a rogue or as a vampire, or within game mechanicsâbut as a person.
The point is: Astarion has come out of a horrific situation, one that has to have left marks, wounds, infected pus festering beneath the skin. A situation that never allowed him to understand what he liked, what he wanted, who he really wasâsimply because he couldnât express himself, couldnât think about his own needs, couldnât say no. Couldnât develop his sense of self in peace and safety.
A situation that left him unable to face the world and the people in it in a healthy way, unable to identify and express his own feelings, unable to say that damn "no" or to make choices. To decide, yes. And in fact, every time heâs asked what he wants to do, his answers are vagueâor he says he doesnât know, or admits that heâs afraid of those damn choices. Heâs afraid of freedom, of consequences, and of everything else beyond the four things he knowsâthe four fucking things Cazador drilled into him, all around power and control.
And Iâm really supposed to believe that the one choice heâs absolutely sure about is Ascension? Hell no. Just like he's not sure he doesn't want to ascend!
References
Rogers, C. R. (1961). On Becoming a Person: A Therapist's View of Psychotherapy. Houghton Mifflin. â A foundational text on the concept of the self, self-actualization, and congruence between real and ideal self.
Winnicott, D. W. (1964). The Child, the Family, and the Outside World. Penguin Books. â Explores the importance of a safe environment in the healthy development of the self.
Bowlby, J. (1969â1980). Attachment and Loss (Vols. 1â3). Basic Books. â Describes how early attachment figures shape our internal working models and sense of security.
Erikson, E. H. (1950). Childhood and Society. W. W. Norton & Company. â Introduces the theory of psychosocial development across the lifespan.
Herman, J. L. (1992). Trauma and Recovery: The Aftermath of ViolenceâFrom Domestic Abuse to Political Terror. Basic Books. â Explains complex trauma, victim-perpetrator dynamics, and the long-term effects of abuse.
van der Kolk, B. A. (2014). The Body Keeps the Score: Brain, Mind, and Body in the Healing of Trauma. Viking. â Offers neuroscientific insight into how trauma reshapes the brain and affects emotional regulation.
Siegel, D. J. (2010). The Mindful Brain: Reflection and Attunement in the Cultivation of Well-Being. W. W. Norton & Company. â Discusses neuroplasticity, integration, and the development of a coherent sense of self.
Kahneman, D. (2011). Thinking, Fast and Slow. Farrar, Straus and Giroux. â A deep dive into heuristics, decision-making, and cognitive biases like confirmation bias.
Malaguti, E., & Morganti, P. (2014). Psychotraumatology: An Integrated Model for Trauma Treatment. (Translated from the Italian). FrancoAngeli. â Addresses the psychological and neurological consequences of prolonged trauma.
Getting caught staring isnât always badâŚ
(We all know Astarion likes it when itâs from the right person) đ
Because it is the anniversary of his death, I wanted to share a small story about my grandfather.
Before I knew that I was intersex, I identified as a trans man. And I went the way any trans man has to go if he wants to transition in my country. My parents thankfully were supportive but I was afraid to tell my grandparents. My grandparents were German and lived/were raised during the third reich. While both of them never said or acted in a way that suggested that they had fascist views (my grandfather was until he died part of a leftwing political party), but there still was this fear in me. "They are old, they grew up surrounded by abhorrent beliefs...". And then there was my aunt. Who would constantly claim that my grandfather was homophobic.
The problem was, back then, there were no openly out gay people in our area, so I never got the chance to see my grandfather interact with someone who was queer. So I just believed her. Because she was so insistent on it. And because it confirmed my fears and my brain loves to be constantly afraid.
But I knew I wanted to come out. I had to, eventually, because I had stopped my estrogen treatment (back then, I did not know that I got that because I was intersex) and went on testosterone instead and first physical changes began to show. We all lived in one big house, so my grandparents would eventually notice.
I was so afraid that my father at some point offered to talk to his parents. I waited outside in the hallway that led to their kitchen and listened.
My father explained, easy to understand, that I was going to transition from female to male because I felt terrible in my body. My grandfather asked, "Is that why the child* is so depressed all this time?" I had been in and out of multiple clinics for manic depression at that point. My father gave a yes. And my grandmother made the incredibly selfish comment, "Can't that wait until I am dead?"
Before I even got time to be upset, my grandfather slammed his fist down on the table. I had never seen or heard him do anything like that before. He was a very calm and collected man who preferred to leave the room before he got too angry. "No, it can't wait. The child gets to get well now. And if that is what is going to help, then it needs to be done."
From that day on, he never used my deadname again or used the wrong pronouns for me. Sometimes, he would stop in a sentence to think and remind himself, but he did always address me correctly.
He celebrated with me when my name was legally changed. He built the bed frame for me and my boyfriend's bed when we moved in together, just like he had built the first adult sized bedframe for me when I outgrew my small bed. He drove my boyfriend to his chemo sessions because my grandfather also had cancer and knew how terrifying it was to go alone.
Did he fully understand what it means to be intersex? To transition? No. But he understood that one of his loved ones was suffering and that he could help to alleviate that pain. And so he did.
He taught me calligraphy. He taught me how to sew. He taught me bookbinding. He gave me many gifts.
But the biggest gift he gave me was, that when someone hated me for what I am, I could stomach it. Because this man was willing to unlearn the bigotry he had been taught for decades so he could love me for who I am.
*in my grandpa's dialect it was normal to refer to children as just 'the child' (genderless)
EDIT
I was blown away by how many people have reblogged this post. I believe my grandfather would be very happy to see that he can give some hope and love to others even now.
I do not want him to stay faceless; so here is a piece of art I made for his obituary, with a slightly altered quote added now.
Dahlias were his favorite flowers. Orange ones especially. They reminded him of the home he had to flee from as a child.
âHe is half of my soul, as the poets say.â
He is so happy i love it
There's a lot of misinformation surrounding this vampire bride fan theory. As someone who has the book the theory allegedly comes from, I want to provide important context that's always left out in posts about it.
Note: It's fine if you like this headcanon and want to use it for your own RP. But posts about this headcanon tend to present it as a factual and canon concept. I want people to have all the information so that they're fully informed when they decide to believe in it or not. There's a lot of evidence that it isn't canon. Everyone is welcome to see their character how they like. No one is saying you can't have fun. The problem is misinformation.
First, the 2e book this theory stems from (Van Richten's Guide to Vampires) is from 1991. That's over 3 decades and three editions of DnD ago. None of this lore has been mentioned in the current edition of DnD, 5e, as far as I've seen. DnD staff have officially said that each edition of DnD is its own canon. They don't want fans to need archaic sourcebooks to understand the current lore.
"The current edition of the D&D roleplaying game has its own canon, as does every other expression of D&D⌠Every edition of the roleplaying game has its own canon as well. In other words, something that might have been treated as canonical in one edition is not necessarily canonical in anotherâŚwe donât want DMs or players to feel like they must read a novel, play a video game, or buy a third-edition sourcebook to enjoy our game and get the most out of our current line of products."
Now, I'm not saying that every edition of DnD is completely different and doesn't draw from older versions. But it's clear that DnD staff don't want old sourcebooks to be needed to understand current products. That's why it's significant that vampire bride lore has not shown up again in a decade of 5e. There is an updated 2021 version of the Van Richten book: Van Richten's Guide to Ravenloft. This 5e version still has no mention of vampire bride lore.
Ravenloft is also a different campaign setting from the Forgotten Realms, which is where BG3 takes place. Their lore is not necessarily interchangeable.
While BG3 doesn't follow DnD 5e lore 100%: One can't use a 2e sourcebook to argue that the vampire bride theory is true, and also say sourcebooks aren't important because BG3 is its own property.
Even if we accept what is in the 1991 Van Richten's Guide to Vampires: The ritual states that the sire vampire's age must be AT LEAST twice Astarion's vampire age.
"Creating a bride or groom, although seemingly a simple process, requires an exhausting exercise of much power by the creating vampire. For this reason, only vampires of advanced age and capability can even assay this procedure. A bride or groom can be created only by a vampire of age category Ancient or greater, and not even all of those are capable of doing so." (pg 71)
The Ancient vampire age category starts at 400 years (pg 13). Astarion has been a vampire spawn for 200 years and an ascended vampire for barely any time at all.
If one argues Astarion can do this ritual anyway because he's a special ascended vampire⌠Well, the book's ritual is about normal vampires. If AA is this unique, it can be easily argued that he can't do the ritual and make a vampire bride, because he's not a normal vampire. This logic can be applied both ways. The idea behind becoming an ascended vampire is that things which affect a normal vampire won't affect him anymore. Not to mention, Astarion himself says it will take more time for him to come into his full power. So how can he be as powerful as an ancient vampire already? Alternatively, if he is this powerful and special, who says he can't compel and control a Vampire Bride anyway?
The book also describes the sire losing lots of blood to the bride, to the point that the sire is weakened. Astarion gives us "just one drop" and shows no sign of being weakened after turning us. Nor do we see evidence of a feeding frenzy.
"The vampire opens a gash in its own fleshâoften in its throatâand holds the subjectâs mouth to the wound. As the burning draught that is the vampireâs blood gushes into the subjectâs mouth, the primitive feeding instinct is triggered, and she sucks hungrily at the wound, enraptured. With the first taste of the blood, the subject is possessed of great and frenzied strength, and will use it to prevent the vampire from separating her from the fountain of wonder that is its bleeding wound. It is at this point that the creator-vampireâs strength is most sorely tested. He is weakened by his own blood loss." (pg 72)
The vampire bride ritual requires the sire to make 3 bites. People disagree over how many times Astarion bites Tav or Durge in the turning scene. And he bites once before the turning if you agree to the romance scene. This is a separate optional bite which tends to get treated as a guaranteed ritual bite.
There's also no evidence of any telepathic bond post-tadpole in the game during the epilogue.
"One of the reasons âmarried vampiresâ are so difficult to defeat is that a vampire and its bride share a telepathic communication that has a range measured in miles. Regardless of intervening terrain or obstacles, the two vampires can communicate instantly and silently as if they were speaking together." (pg 74)
Even if we accept the outdated 2e lore of vampire brides, there's numerous ways that the ritual in the sourcebook doesn't match what happens when AA turns Tav or Durge. Depending on how you count the bites, one can argue that nothing from the ritual matches what's in the game!
Great addition by @/nicsnort: "Let us also not forget that the very nature of necromancy and undeath changed between 2e and 5e due to the Spellplague and the destruction of the Negative Energy Plane. So, not only is the canon of the Bride ritual outdated, but this ritual very well may not work anymore for even 400+-year-old vampires because magic itself is different!"
This is without even talking about how something so major which goes against everything we're told about master-spawn relationships in the game... would have been clearly discussed in the actual game.
On the topic of what's in the actual game: Just because the player character can walk in the sun doesn't mean they aren't a vampire spawn. Cazador gives some of his spawn the ability to teleport, and the companions express surprise that it's possible. Yet no one denies they are still vampire spawn.
I hope this post gives you extra context on the vampire bride theory. Overall, it's clear that this is old lore which is not canon to the current edition of DnD. Whether you think Larian decided to apply it to BG3 or not, at least now that belief will be fully informed.
If this post was useful or interesting to you, please reblog so more people can see it! I've made a updates to it a few times to address replies I've had, so check my original post for the latest version.
Predaetor Astarion đşđЏ
Tomorrow Catch 22 Sylus x Astarion. Uhm, yes⌠I love my silver-haired, crimson-eyed men.
Pairing: Astarion x female Tav
Tags: Smut, bath sex, cunnilingus.
Word count: 5,4k
Winter = cold, bath = warm. Things certainly get steamy.
This is my contribution to the wonderful @bg3-winter-big-bang project. I wrote a fun winter-themed Tavstarion smut fic while the lovely @elorathebard provided the beautiful render based on a scene in the fic!
You can see the full fic alongside the full image on AO3 here.
KarlachâŚthatâs not-
The first of my Astarion February YCHs for @preciouslittlebhaalbae featuring Erin (thanks so very much!)
Angelic devil đ¸
There's a lot of misinformation surrounding this vampire bride fan theory. As someone who has the book the theory allegedly comes from, I want to provide important context that's always left out in posts about it.
Note: It's fine if you like this headcanon and want to use it for your own RP. But posts about this headcanon tend to present it as a factual and canon concept. I want people to have all the information so that they're fully informed when they decide to believe in it or not. There's a lot of evidence that it isn't canon.
First, the 2e book this theory stems from (Van Richten's Guide to Vampires) is from 1991. That's over 3 decades and three editions of DnD ago. None of this lore has been mentioned in the current edition of DnD, 5e, as far as I've seen. DnD staff have officially said that each edition of DnD is its own canon. There is also an updated version of the book from 2021 (Van Richten's Guide to Ravenloft). This 5e version still has no mention of vampire bride lore.
Ravenloft is also a different setting from the Forgotten Realms. Their lore is not necessarily interchangeable.
Even if we accept what is in the 1991 Van Richten's Guide to Vampires: The ritual states that the sire vampire's age must be AT LEAST twice Astarion's vampire age.
"Creating a bride or groom, although seemingly a simple process, requires an exhausting exercise of much power by the creating vampire. For this reason, only vampires of advanced age and capability can even assay this procedure. A bride or groom can be created only by a vampire of age category Ancient or greater, and not even all of those are capable of doing so." (pg 71)
The Ancient vampire age category starts at 400 years (pg 13). Astarion has been a vampire spawn for 200 years and an ascended vampire for barely any time at all.
If you argue Astarion can do this ritual anyway because he's a special ascended vampire... Well, the book's ritual is about normal vampires. If AA is this unique, it can be easily argued that he can't do the ritual and make a vampire bride because he's not a normal vampire. This logic can be applied both ways. Not to mention, Astarion himself says it will take more time for him to come into his full power. So how can he be as powerful as an ancient vampire already?
The book also describes the sire losing lots of blood to the bride, to the point that the sire is weakened. Astarion gives us "just one drop" and shows no sign of being weakened after turning us. Nor do we see evidence of a feeding frenzy.
"The vampire opens a gash in its own fleshâoften in its throatâand holds the subjectâs mouth to the wound. As the burning draught that is the vampireâs blood gushes into the subjectâs mouth, the primitive feeding instinct is triggered, and she sucks hungrily at the wound, enraptured. With the first taste of the blood, the subject is possessed of great and frenzied strength, and will use it to prevent the vampire from separating her from the fountain of wonder that is its bleeding wound. It is at this point that the creator-vampireâs strength is most sorely tested. He is weakened by his own blood loss." (pg 72)
The vampire bride ritual requires the sire to make 3 bites. People disagree over how many times Astarion bites Tav or Durge in the turning scene. And he bites once before the turning if you agree to the romance scene. This is a separate optional bite which tends to get treated as a guaranteed ritual bite.
There's also no evidence of any telepathic bond post-tadpole in the game during the epilogue.
"One of the reasons âmarried vampiresâ are so difficult to defeat is that a vampire and its bride share a telepathic communication that has a range measured in miles. Regardless of intervening terrain or obstacles, the two vampires can communicate instantly and silently as if they were speaking together." (pg 74)
Even if we accept the outdated 2e lore of vampire brides, there's numerous ways that the ritual in the sourcebook doesn't match what happens when AA turns Tav or Durge.
Great addition by @/nicsnort: "Let us also not forget that the very nature of necromancy and undeath changed between 2e and 5e due to the Spellplague and the destruction of the Negative Energy Plane. So, not only is the canon of the Bride ritual outdated, but this ritual very well may not work anymore for even 400+-year-old vampires because magic itself is different!"
I hope this post gives you extra context on the vampire bride theory. Overall, it's clear that this is old lore which is not canon to the current edition of DnD. Whether you think Larian decided to apply it to BG3 or not, at least now that belief will be fully informed.
If this post was useful or interesting to you, please reblog so more people can see it!
Astarion
A little Batstarion for a lovely friend
My opinion is that sex is like... a normal body function and I think it's weird to say somebody is a good or bad person or a loser or a cool guy or whatever based on how much sex they have. whether its a lot of sex or no sex at all. attaching moral judgement to how much sex you have feels like judging someone based on how often they go to the bathroom
Theme 1 đApple - Courtship - Forgive me, Astarion, but I can't treat you to an apple in return, it's rotten⌠- It's okay, I don't eat apples
A regular ripe apple represents the human side of Sangvia, a bard with a kind heart and open to the world. But a rotten apple is a symbol of her DU side. But because of her Ex, Sanya sees herself as a rotten apple entirely and doesn't think she's worthy of Astarion and what he offers.
A second look. Astarion offers his feelings in the form of a red apple, and Sangvia accepts it tenderly but with shame. After all, in her hands she holds an apple of other feelings, those that She gave her in the past. And despite all their rottenness, Sanya still finds it difficult to let it go. There is a challenge on VK dedicated to intimacy between characters. Since I couldn't draw anything on 14, I decided to participate in this event! And the first theme suited me so well, because apples are the symbol of Sangvia QwQ
Theme 1 đApple - Courtship - Forgive me, Astarion, but I can't treat you to an apple in return, it's rotten⌠- It's okay, I don't eat apples
A regular ripe apple represents the human side of Sangvia, a bard with a kind heart and open to the world. But a rotten apple is a symbol of her DU side. But because of her Ex, Sanya sees herself as a rotten apple entirely and doesn't think she's worthy of Astarion and what he offers.
A second look. Astarion offers his feelings in the form of a red apple, and Sangvia accepts it tenderly but with shame. After all, in her hands she holds an apple of other feelings, those that She gave her in the past. And despite all their rottenness, Sanya still finds it difficult to let it go. There is a challenge on VK dedicated to intimacy between characters. Since I couldn't draw anything on 14, I decided to participate in this event! And the first theme suited me so well, because apples are the symbol of Sangvia QwQ
musk is going to die in a Tesla explosion in 6 months after sticking his nose where it doesn't belong and we will never get a conclusive answer on whether it was a CIA car bomb or just a normal Tesla malfunction
A couple of quick concept sketches of Ascended Astarion Dragonblood Sorcerer for the dark fantasy novel đš
you know even if a homeless person or a starving person is in that position because of their own "bad decisions" i don't care. it doesn't matter. no supposed financial misstep is enough to condemn someone to homelessness or poverty.
"I already hear the world whispering in sweet surrender."
weird anon being summoned here.
So I recently watched Bones and All (hope youâre familiar with it, Iâd feel bad spoiling it in case you arenât but are interested in it!) - and Iâve been unable to stop thinking about the ending. Do you think that, when Tavâs life was coming to an end and theyâd ask Astarion for it, would he do a bones and all on them and feed from them one last time, draining them dry? Personally, I think my Tav would see it as a last goodbye, giving him a chance at savoring their blood/the memory of feeding on them one last time while also slipping away rather peacefully (judging by how the narrator frames it during bite night when you donât stop him, it isnât very painful and you just drift off.). Iâve been torturing myself with the mental image of Astarion being extremely emotional while trying to honor Tavâs last wish, trying to savor that connection one last time while also grieving immensely and maybe struggling with a sense of guilt for a few days now.
anon you're going to kill me. i've never seen that movie but this is so fucking sad
i know in my heart that astarion would absolutely hate doing it, but if tav asked i think he would.
another funeral rite i can see him doing is keeping a vial of tav's blood somewhere, like in a pendant or something. the vampire version of keeping a lock of someone's hair. or have it preserved as a gem for a ring
This image was created with Picrewâs âăăŽĺăăăŁăĄăčŚăŚăăâ!! https://picrew.me/share?cd=DoCRPthPeQ #Picrew #ăăŽĺăăăŁăĄăčŚăŚăă
Use this picrew to show me your Dadstarion babies!
Here's my precious Estelle - daughter of Astarion and Serafina.
Tagging some persons of interest but anyone can play! @wilteddreamsofbaldursgate @coreene @thechaoticdruid @spacebarbarianweird @vixstarria (yes your fail son)
@snowfolly @tallymonster @spin-birdie